By Katrina Belcher (katrinabelcher@mmaratings.net)
Being a female in the MMA world, I’ve talked to a lot of men about my involvement in this industry. I find most men are either for, or against, women fighters in the world of MMA. Not one man I’ve spoken to is on the fence. They either think it’s cool, or they don’t like to see females fighting. I’m not sure we’ll ever be able to change the minds of men who feel that way…they just don’t like it. They don’t like to see “delicate” females bloodying each other up. Some women don’t like to watch men hit each other in the boxing ring. It’s just how they feel. And it doesn’t mean the person is good, bad or evil. Personal preference.
Should Women Fighters Earn the Same as their Male Counterparts?
Setting the above feelings aside — let’s talk about earnings for female fighters in the MMA industry. Certainly it’s true you cannot compare a no-named female MMA fighter against the likes of a Randy Couture or Chuck Liddell, but a few years ago you wouldn’t have been able to compare Chuck Liddell to the likes of Randy Couture. HOWEVER, I think the point here is that it’s obvious female fighters have a MUCH longer way to go, before they earn the types of fees awarded to their male counterparts. You may not know who a female fighter is, because female fights are not televised, publicized and put on PPV like the men’s fights are — but that does not mean they aren’t well-known. They just aren’t well-known by the major populace. And they aren’t well-known because they’re not good or haven’t been around — rather, it’s because, well, see my prior sentence. Female fights aren’t yet in the public eye. Consequently, female fighting events and venues don’t earn the same amount of revenue as the all male fighting events. It stands to reason, then, that they don’t yet have the same earning power as male fighters.
Just like in an “office” work environment, however, I personally feel that if the fight card has men and women on it, then it’s only fair to pay the same win/place/participation fee to each fighter — whether a man or woman. That isn’t happening yet. I know of events where the male champion will earn $2,500 for the night – and the woman only gets $500. IMHO that is sexist and unfair, especially when you consider that the training each female fighter received, the training gear she bought, the time spent, and the fees she paid for her training, for the gym/training center and her training time were the same fees paid by her male counterpart. Think about it. No one has ever said to a woman “hey – because you’re just a female, we’ll only charge you 1/3 of what we’re charging the guys for their training, or for your training gear…” That’s never happened. I don’t think anyone would dare!
So should female fighters in the MMA industry get paid the same as their male counterparts? Absolutely. The question is…how? IMO I think we need to increase visability. Ask your manager to get fights for you on those all male cards. Encourage other female fighters to ask their managers to do the same. And when you commit to a fight — GO! No excuses. Show up and fight. Prove your value. Soon, the people who are watching will turn into fans. Fans will want to see more of you…and will make sure to attend your fight events. They’ll even bring their friends. After a while, female fight venues will bring in as much revenue as their male counterparts – and a higher paycheck for their fighters.
So no, female MMA fighters don’t earn the same fees as the men do — yet. That’s okay though, ’cause, well –we’re fighters, we’re women and we’re patient. We’ll get there soon.
I am fine with women fighting if they want but they definitely should not be paid the same as male fighters.
In fact, paying female fighters the same as male fighters would be unfair to the male fighters. Most people dont go to MMA events to see the one female fight on a card with nine other male fights. They just dont. If it comes to a point where a female fighter has actual drawing power in terms of ticket sales, then yes, she should be paid accordingly (a la Gina Carano). But just automatically paying female fighters the same as male fighters isnt going to happen and shouldnt.
Recently I have realized why many men (and women) do not like female fighting. On one of the last strikeforce cards Randy Couture’s wife fought a woman who clearly did not belong in the ring, and frankly, did not look like she wants to be in the ring. It was just a one sided beatdown as the opponent ran away, turned her back, like a complete amateur who really should not have been allowed to fight. And this was only against an 0-1 fighter in Couture’s wife. Now that was truly disgusting. And its not a female thing. I dont want to see a man being beaten up who has no business in the ring. And that is the problem. People watch MMA to see competition. Skilled, evenly matched fighters fighters fight eachother. People who know how to fight fight eachother. Sure, there are one sided beatdowns in male MMA, but at least the male KO victims dont run and cower like many female fighters do. The lack of talent and shameful matchmaking in female MMA make it highly unappealing to anyone who wants to see good competitive fights, and not overmatched, cringeworthy beatdowns.
Hey Sam – I don’t understand your reasoning – it doesn’t make any sense to me. Who said female fighters should be “automatically paid” the same as men? What I’m saying is that if a female has the same training background, experience and level of skill as a male, and they both go to fight in the ring, then they should be paid the same. The man shouldn’t be paid more “just because he’s a man”…and yet in today’s society he does.
Another point of contention: are you saying women fighters are the only ones who run and cower? I beg to differ with you my friend. Apparently you weren’t at the last MMA fight event here in Knoxville. There were only male fighters, and most matches ended in the first round – usually with one of the fighters (a man) practically crying, cowering, and begging his opponent to not hurt him! Some fell to the mat and started tapping just as their opponent got to them! It was just sad.
Don’t confuse fighters who are just beginning with ammy’s or pro’s. Big difference. In fact, IMO beginners should fight only each other, in the ring, for a minimum of 3 fights before stepping into the ring w/an ammy. Get them used to the ring scenario. Different subject, sort of, but there are a lot of wannabe “MMA fighters” who think they’re bad a**, UNTIL they get out of the gym and step into the ring. Ring fighting, with a crowd around you, is very intimidating. Those are the fighters you’ll see crying and cowering, and they’re men.
If you think female fighters are not skilled and, at least for the most part evenly matched, and/or that they don’t know how to fight each other, then I don’t think you’re getting out much. Some of the most vicious, knock-down, drag out fights I’ve seen have been the female ones, all while the men are playing tug-the-weenie on the ground.
You say it’s not a female thing, but I think for you it is. Out of all the fights I’ve seen, I’ve only seen one where the female was afraid to fight. The rest of the fighters I’vc witnessed cowering were men…and pretty much because it was their first time in the ring.
the only reason, IMHO, that there’s more men who’ve cowered, run, or generally given up in ring or cage is because there’s been so many more men’s matches. the ratio has to be ten to one, in the history of the sport. when we get more women fighting, we’ll get more mismatches. the talent pool is just small right now. that will change.
((Ha, last night I couldn’t get the damn comment thing to work, and i saved this to post later, and realized i’d forgotten to post it just now. it’s basically what katrina says.))
sam, not one of your comments is dependent on the person you’re talking about being a woman. skill level has nothing to do with female-ness. you’re assuming that at least one of the fighters in an MMA match would be unskilled or cowardly. how many women have you seen fight? I’ve seen a lot, and i can’t honestly figure out what your point is. the issue about compensation seems pretty obvious, and again, has zero to do with gender. right now there’s one woman commands headliner status, gina carano. there’s more men who can command headliner status, and they make more money. what does this have to do with someone’s gender? i mean, your point was that it was a one-sided beatdown, correct? so you state that “i have realized why many men (and women) do not like female fighting” then a couple sentences later say “and its not a female thing”. so how is that a reason for people to not like WOMEN fighting?
the cultural issues are more interesting, and have been around for a while. katrina’s right in that some people just don’t like women fighting. i admit that it makes me uncomfortable sometimes, when a fighter gets really beat up, more so than when a male gets the same kind of beatdown. i was raised to be very protective of women, but i’ve grown to feel that it’s somewhat infantilizing as well, not to mention condescending. women get to choose what they do, like it or not. its called freedom. and if they want to fight, that’s their choice. i think the real issue it women in traditionally male roles, and that, historically, has ALWAYS faded with time. less than a couple generations ago women driving was seen as shocking. women wearing pants were called horrific names and sometimes jailed! the dislike of women fighting is a cultural artifact that will eventually be gone.
They may not have been driving, but I’m sure they were still driving men crazy.
But I’m glad they can wear pants, especially tight ones.
Here, here, garth2, and thanks; your points are well-taken. And Eric – as usual, you crack me up.
I agree!
Excuse me.
As a Woman, I have grown up, even in today’s day, with people telling me that men will almost always have the upper hand. However, in my family, I was raised to believe that people have equal rights, whether you’re black, white, asian mexican, Male, or Female. I grew up watching sparring and the fights with my family and participated in it as well. Now let me tell you, I am a proud teenage Girl who likes to kick butt. I’m not going to sit around and listen to people tell me that because of who God made me, I can’t do something. I’ve embraced the person He’s made me to be. I’m a fighter. And I’m no quitter.
I have watched fight after fight, screaming at the television as many Male fighters were being beat down and watched as they cowered in a corner of the ring. Are you joking with me? If you’re going to say, Sam, that many women fighters “cower” in the face of another opponent – Fine. I don’t think I could change that for you, but seriously take a second to look at your own hypocritical statement. Men can be as much of a sissy as the supposedly women are.
I’ve just got to say, look how far we’ve come. And I can’t wait to see where the world of MMA for W-o-m-e-n is going to go. I mean, Hello! This is the 21st century.
Oh and Katrina made the point of whether or not female fighters should be paid the same amount as men, and I’m like, “DUH”. There are no if’s, and’s or but’s about it.
Chelsea, what do you think about this: http://blog.mmaratings.net/2008/05/womens-mma.html
I agree!
((Ha, last night I couldn't get the damn comment thing to work, and i saved this to post later, and realized i'd forgotten to post it just now. it's basically what katrina says.))
sam, not one of your comments is dependent on the person you're talking about being a woman. skill level has nothing to do with female-ness. you're assuming that at least one of the fighters in an MMA match would be unskilled or cowardly. how many women have you seen fight? I've seen a lot, and i can't honestly figure out what your point is. the issue about compensation seems pretty obvious, and again, has zero to do with gender. right now there's one woman commands headliner status, gina carano. there's more men who can command headliner status, and they make more money. what does this have to do with someone's gender? i mean, your point was that it was a one-sided beatdown, correct? so you state that "i have realized why many men (and women) do not like female fighting" then a couple sentences later say "and its not a female thing". so how is that a reason for people to not like WOMEN fighting?
the cultural issues are more interesting, and have been around for a while. katrina's right in that some people just don't like women fighting. i admit that it makes me uncomfortable sometimes, when a fighter gets really beat up, more so than when a male gets the same kind of beatdown. i was raised to be very protective of women, but i've grown to feel that it's somewhat infantilizing as well, not to mention condescending. women get to choose what they do, like it or not. its called freedom. and if they want to fight, that's their choice. i think the real issue it women in traditionally male roles, and that, historically, has ALWAYS faded with time. less than a couple generations ago women driving was seen as shocking. women wearing pants were called horrific names and sometimes jailed! the dislike of women fighting is a cultural artifact that will eventually be gone.
They may not have been driving, but I'm sure they were still driving men crazy.
But I'm glad they can wear pants, especially tight ones.
I am fine with women fighting if they want but they definitely should not be paid the same as male fighters.
In fact, paying female fighters the same as male fighters would be unfair to the male fighters. Most people dont go to MMA events to see the one female fight on a card with nine other male fights. They just dont. If it comes to a point where a female fighter has actual drawing power in terms of ticket sales, then yes, she should be paid accordingly (a la Gina Carano). But just automatically paying female fighters the same as male fighters isnt going to happen and shouldnt.
Recently I have realized why many men (and women) do not like female fighting. On one of the last strikeforce cards Randy Couture's wife fought a woman who clearly did not belong in the ring, and frankly, did not look like she wants to be in the ring. It was just a one sided beatdown as the opponent ran away, turned her back, like a complete amateur who really should not have been allowed to fight. And this was only against an 0-1 fighter in Couture's wife. Now that was truly disgusting. And its not a female thing. I dont want to see a man being beaten up who has no business in the ring. And that is the problem. People watch MMA to see competition. Skilled, evenly matched fighters fighters fight eachother. People who know how to fight fight eachother. Sure, there are one sided beatdowns in male MMA, but at least the male KO victims dont run and cower like many female fighters do. The lack of talent and shameful matchmaking in female MMA make it highly unappealing to anyone who wants to see good competitive fights, and not overmatched, cringeworthy beatdowns.